360 Arcade Games on the Zune

ChaosKingdom · 05-30-2008, 03:00 PM

Will the zune ever see ports of some of the games that are already released on the 360's arcade? I think that many games on the arcade can transit well (N+, Geometry Wars) to the zune. Of course I am not taking copyrights or anything like that into consideration. So, what games from the 360 arcade do you want for the zune?

SimReality · 05-30-2008, 03:35 PM

99.9% of them will not transition well. Then you factor in the fact that the Xbox 360 can render much more complicated stuff (not just counting 3D, it's magnitudes faster at 2D than the Zune) and you see that there is pretty much no chance of this working. Plus most of those game developers won't put any effort into it because there is no profit to be had on the Zune at the time being. And we all know money ultimately runs the world.

Ace1tk · 05-30-2008, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SimReality

99.9% of them will not transition well. Then you factor in the fact that the Xbox 360 can render much more complicated stuff (not just counting 3D, it's magnitudes faster at 2D than the Zune) and you see that there is pretty much no chance of this working. Plus most of those game developers won't put any effort into it because there is no profit to be had on the Zune at the time being. And we all know money ultimately runs the world.

Thats not entirely true. If youve seen Valgards Fate(game currently under construction by one of the zuneboard members) than youll notice that the game is almost exactly like the RPG kit made for 2.0 meaning it was made for xbox360 and windows deployment. He could'nt have made that game from the ground up look exactly like that in less than a week. which means that it was origally for the360 and windows platforms. Meaning that wht you just said is'nt true. Maybe you could say SOME of the arcade games using 3d and libraries that arent made available and those using hardware accelration cant bne ported to the zune. So it would be better if you rephrased that comment please. and if you do not believe me search Valgards Fate on the boards. Thanx

SimReality · 05-31-2008, 01:31 AM

He has a simple, tile-based sprite drawing system. That's simple and easy to do and not very graphically taxing. We're talking Xbox LIVE Arcade games. Geometry Wars? Not a chance. Maybe simplified, but as-is that game would eat the Zune alive. Not to mention it requires dual analog sticks to even work. Any of the arcade games that use 3D graphics? Instantly can't be done.

If you are making a game targetting the Zune (as in Valgard's Fate), then of course you can make it work on the platform. But you cannot take the majority of the existing XBLA titles and expect them to port down to the Zune. It simply won't work.

masonpwiley · 05-31-2008, 09:45 AM

Geometry Wars wouldn't work. It requires a pretty good system, surprisingly.

Ace1tk · 05-31-2008, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SimReality

He has a simple, tile-based sprite drawing system. That's simple and easy to do and not very graphically taxing. We're talking Xbox LIVE Arcade games. Geometry Wars? Not a chance. Maybe simplified, but as-is that game would eat the Zune alive. Not to mention it requires dual analog sticks to even work. Any of the arcade games that use 3D graphics? Instantly can't be done.

If you are making a game targetting the Zune (as in Valgard's Fate), then of course you can make it work on the platform. But you cannot take the majority of the existing XBLA titles and expect them to port down to the Zune. It simply won't work.

I understand that, you'd have to strip alot of the code and then again wouldnt The original geometry wars(retro) be playable on the zune im not talking about retro evolved or evolved. I've seen plenty of clones that do not require dual analog and utilize a one hand playable system and plenty that are simple yet fun, it doesnt necessarily have to be the original title but something along the lines of it. Of course LIVE games would'nt work, different API's and libraries. The zune doesnt have hardware acceleration and cant produce 3d images. Maybe future zunes woud be able too but we're not up to that standard yet. im not even a developer or programmer but i do my research :p

DiNoGames · 06-06-2008, 03:47 PM

Hi there, I just recognized you talking about Valgards fate here.

Ace1tk, I really appreciate your faith in my skills

But the name Valgards fate is a name I used from a Delphi-Windows game I started about one year ago. The name and the players sprite is all that was made for another platform than the Zune. The whole game was made from scratch in that mentioned week (at the point you wrote that). I totally agree with SimReality here.

The Zune is no gaming platform. Its a MP3 and video player. I am very glad Microsoft enables us to make games for the Zune, but we have to deal with many drawbacks the platform brings with it. We have absolutely no acceleration of anything. We just have the ARM 533 Mhz processor (I guess) and 16 MB of RAM. No video card, no video RAM, no shaders, no 3D, no acceleration in anything, no nothing.

What you can do is port an "idea" of a game to the Zune as long as the input can cope with the single "thumbstick" we have. But almost every game on XBoxLive Arcade utilizes 3D capabilities we do not have on the Zune.

To be honest.... if you think Valgards fate looks good, its not because the Zune can do so great looking things. The graphics are all prerendered and just sprites. Nothing more. We just have the Spritebatch to render things on the Zune.

Greetings,
Dirk

cable729 · 06-07-2008, 03:19 PM

halo for zune... haha

Ricardo Dawkins · 06-09-2008, 02:02 PM

I still maintain my position. if Doom can be ported to some underpowered DAPs (compared to the Zune) like old Archos units, iriver H320 & H340 series, Sansa E2xx and Toshiba Gigabeat X & F series.....why we can't get some gameplay like Doom or Duke Nukem...

I know Doom (original) is not true 3D, uses shaders and things like that. Come on...the Zune can get at least to that level. dont tell me this cant be done.

SimReality · 06-09-2008, 02:11 PM

Sure it's doable technically. But why? The gameplay experience wouldn't be nearly as fun using the input device. At least not in my mind. You'd have to hold it portrait or find a weird way to hold it to be worth it since you'd want Play to be shoot (so you could move and shoot at the same time).

I still firmly believe that to create a good Zune game you have to really focus on making something work for the hardware.

seifer93 · 06-11-2008, 01:05 PM

Although I would love to see the arcade games on the Zune (I voted yes) Most probably wont work well on the Zune. It isn't "meant" for games, especially generation 1 (what I have). Many 360 games have some advanced features like gravity, physics, and 3d graphics. The Zune can only process these things in moderation (excluding 3d which it doesn't support).

backlash92 · 06-13-2008, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ricardo Dawkins

I still maintain my position. if Doom can be ported to some underpowered DAPs (compared to the Zune) like old Archos units, iriver H320 & H340 series, Sansa E2xx and Toshiba Gigabeat X & F series.....why we can't get some gameplay like Doom or Duke Nukem...

I know Doom (original) is not true 3D, uses shaders and things like that. Come on...the Zune can get at least to that level. dont tell me this cant be done.

Actually I think someone is working on a fps for the Zune, look in the development section of the games here. Oh and the original Doom was 2.5d along with Wolfenstein 3d, which I think is the same technique the person making the Zune game is using.

adamburns123 · 06-14-2008, 10:32 AM

i dont think you could do it but if you go do that math game that would be awesome

ChaosKingdom · 06-25-2008, 03:41 PM

wow, I wasn't expecting this thread to turn out this way. I know that the current Zune models are not able to handle the live games on the 360, but it is still nice to think about. Thanks for keeping my poll alive, even though I don't have the slightest idea what you all are talking about.

Johnny · 06-26-2008, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ricardo Dawkins

I still maintain my position. if Doom can be ported to some underpowered DAPs (compared to the Zune) like old Archos units, iriver H320 & H340 series, Sansa E2xx and Toshiba Gigabeat X & F series.....why we can't get some gameplay like Doom or Duke Nukem...

I know Doom (original) is not true 3D, uses shaders and things like that. Come on...the Zune can get at least to that level. dont tell me this cant be done.

I guess you have to note that its different on those devices as your not limited to the XNA Framework. It could be done, and heck, its still early days, we'll get around to making some sweet looking techniques eventually.

And hopefully when/if MS announce a distribution model for Zune XNA games (similar to the forthcoming Xbox Live version, albiet hopefully not 2 years after the tech came out), we may see some game companies jump on board, which should have more polished feels.

More on topic, I guess you could make interpretations of current Live Arcade games; Uno for sure (or any of the card games), Tetris etc, but those kinda games are on EVERYTHING basically, because their simple. I guess you really have to focus on the Zune's designs.

Scatman2009 · 07-02-2008, 11:01 AM

doesn't really matter to me.
If some are made then I'll take advantage of em, if not, I'll be ok

Charon91 · 07-06-2008, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SimReality

Sure it's doable technically. But why? The gameplay experience wouldn't be nearly as fun using the input device. At least not in my mind. You'd have to hold it portrait or find a weird way to hold it to be worth it since you'd want Play to be shoot (so you could move and shoot at the same time).

I still firmly believe that to create a good Zune game you have to really focus on making something work for the hardware.

Heres my view on it: Mario from the NES to Gameboy. It sold, why? Simple, it was portable. People love portability.

Dubs · 07-06-2008, 10:32 PM

I doubt they would be able to make a direct port from the 360 to the Zune, but I could definitely see Microsoft and the game developers making special Zune versions of some of the popular Xbox 360 Arcade games. And even if the "Official" developers don't make their games for the Zune, I'm sure some Homebrew programmers will make them.

DiNoGames · 07-08-2008, 04:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dubs

And even if the "Official" developers don't make their games for the Zune, I'm sure some Homebrew programmers will make them.

....... of course AFTER asking the original developers about permission, because otherwise we have another problem called copyright infringement...

Flash Gordon · 08-12-2008, 11:33 PM

I saw that and I literally said:

d;lfkas;lfkja;lfdsjakf;sjdfksalfdsaf

View Poll Results: Would you like to see 360 games on the Zune?
Yes	73	78.49%
No	1	1.08%
Indifferent	6	6.45%
There is a reason why they are on the 360	13	13.98%
Voters: 93. You may not vote on this poll

05-30-2008, 03:00 PM	#1 (permalink)
ChaosKingdom Squirt Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 25 Reputation: 10	360 Arcade Games on the Zune Will the zune ever see ports of some of the games that are already released on the 360's arcade? I think that many games on the arcade can transit well (N+, Geometry Wars) to the zune. Of course I am not taking copyrights or anything like that into consideration. So, what games from the 360 arcade do you want for the zune?

06-06-2008, 03:47 PM	#7 (permalink)
DiNoGames zB Programmer Jr. Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Bremen, germany Posts: 408 Reputation: 172	Hi there, I just recognized you talking about Valgards fate here. Ace1tk, I really appreciate your faith in my skills But the name Valgards fate is a name I used from a Delphi-Windows game I started about one year ago. The name and the players sprite is all that was made for another platform than the Zune. The whole game was made from scratch in that mentioned week (at the point you wrote that). I totally agree with SimReality here. The Zune is no gaming platform. Its a MP3 and video player. I am very glad Microsoft enables us to make games for the Zune, but we have to deal with many drawbacks the platform brings with it. We have absolutely no acceleration of anything. We just have the ARM 533 Mhz processor (I guess) and 16 MB of RAM. No video card, no video RAM, no shaders, no 3D, no acceleration in anything, no nothing. What you can do is port an "idea" of a game to the Zune as long as the input can cope with the single "thumbstick" we have. But almost every game on XBoxLive Arcade utilizes 3D capabilities we do not have on the Zune. To be honest.... if you think Valgards fate looks good, its not because the Zune can do so great looking things. The graphics are all prerendered and just sprites. Nothing more. We just have the Spritebatch to render things on the Zune. Greetings, Dirk __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

06-09-2008, 02:02 PM	#9 (permalink)
Ricardo Dawkins Jr. Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 356 Reputation: 30	I still maintain my position. if Doom can be ported to some underpowered DAPs (compared to the Zune) like old Archos units, iriver H320 & H340 series, Sansa E2xx and Toshiba Gigabeat X & F series.....why we can't get some gameplay like Doom or Duke Nukem... I know Doom (original) is not true 3D, uses shaders and things like that. Come on...the Zune can get at least to that level. dont tell me this cant be done. __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Black Zune 80 & Samsung YH-J70 + Zune 80 Premium + AKG K26p + JVC HA-FX33 Blue -Marshmallows- *To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.*

05-30-2008, 03:35 PM	#2 (permalink)
SimReality Jr. Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 410 Reputation: 60	99.9% of them will not transition well. Then you factor in the fact that the Xbox 360 can render much more complicated stuff (not just counting 3D, it's magnitudes faster at 2D than the Zune) and you see that there is pretty much no chance of this working. Plus most of those game developers won't put any effort into it because there is no profit to be had on the Zune at the time being. And we all know money ultimately runs the world.

05-31-2008, 01:31 AM	#4 (permalink)
SimReality Jr. Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 410 Reputation: 60	He has a simple, tile-based sprite drawing system. That's simple and easy to do and not very graphically taxing. We're talking Xbox LIVE Arcade games. Geometry Wars? Not a chance. Maybe simplified, but as-is that game would eat the Zune alive. Not to mention it requires dual analog sticks to even work. Any of the arcade games that use 3D graphics? Instantly can't be done. If you are making a game targetting the Zune (as in Valgard's Fate), then of course you can make it work on the platform. But you cannot take the majority of the existing XBLA titles and expect them to port down to the Zune. It simply won't work.

05-31-2008, 09:45 AM	#5 (permalink)
masonpwiley Zuner Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 72 Reputation: 9	Geometry Wars wouldn't work. It requires a pretty good system, surprisingly.

06-07-2008, 03:19 PM	#8 (permalink)
cable729 Experienced Zuner Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 217 Reputation: 14	halo for zune... haha

06-09-2008, 02:11 PM	#10 (permalink)
SimReality Jr. Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 410 Reputation: 60	Sure it's doable technically. But why? The gameplay experience wouldn't be nearly as fun using the input device. At least not in my mind. You'd have to hold it portrait or find a weird way to hold it to be worth it since you'd want Play to be shoot (so you could move and shoot at the same time). I still firmly believe that to create a good Zune game you have to really focus on making something work for the hardware.

06-11-2008, 01:05 PM	#11 (permalink)
seifer93 Zuner Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 56 Reputation: 11	Although I would love to see the arcade games on the Zune (I voted yes) Most probably wont work well on the Zune. It isn't "meant" for games, especially generation 1 (what I have). Many 360 games have some advanced features like gravity, physics, and 3d graphics. The Zune can only process these things in moderation (excluding 3d which it doesn't support).

06-14-2008, 10:32 AM	#13 (permalink)
adamburns123 Jr. Zuner Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 34 Reputation: 10	i dont think you could do it but if you go do that math game that would be awesome

06-25-2008, 03:41 PM	#14 (permalink)
ChaosKingdom Squirt Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 25 Reputation: 10	wow, I wasn't expecting this thread to turn out this way. I know that the current Zune models are not able to handle the live games on the 360, but it is still nice to think about. Thanks for keeping my poll alive, even though I don't have the slightest idea what you all are talking about.

07-02-2008, 11:01 AM	#16 (permalink)
Scatman2009 Experienced Zuner Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 209 Reputation: 32	doesn't really matter to me. If some are made then I'll take advantage of em, if not, I'll be ok

07-06-2008, 10:32 PM	#18 (permalink)
Dubs Zewbie Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 1 Reputation: 10	I doubt they would be able to make a direct port from the 360 to the Zune, but I could definitely see Microsoft and the game developers making special Zune versions of some of the popular Xbox 360 Arcade games. And even if the "Official" developers don't make their games for the Zune, I'm sure some Homebrew programmers will make them.

08-12-2008, 11:33 PM	#20 (permalink)
Flash Gordon Experienced Zuner Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Phoenix, Arizona Posts: 215 Reputation: 117	I saw that and I literally said: d;lfkas;lfkja;lfdsjakf;sjdfksalfdsaf

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