Zune Library Organization: Tips and Tricks/Sorting Duplicates/Adding to Library

[Khu]

I have a bit of an OCD streak at times. That has spilled over into organizing my library and getting it to display properly on the device itself. Here are few tips for organization and verification of your library.

Organizing your library on your hard drive is important and should go without saying. Still, making my living as a software developer always keeps organization in the forefront for me. Still, you should spend some time making sure files are stored where and how you like to make using the Zune software go a bit easier. By no means does one have to organize this way but you may find something useful in my methods.

First, pick a central location for your various types of files. I separate my content into the following:

• Music
• Video
• Podcasts
• Pictures

I no longer have separate directories by genre. However, I do follow an Artist/Album/Tracks structure. Much of the other organization can be performed using the tags for each file.

I monitor all of the library directories but have some control in that there is a special Video and Pictures directory set up for the Zune library. Normally, I will rip to an unmonitored directory and then move files over when ready to bring them into my library.

Using a tool like Magic File Renamer can help in organizing the tags but there are many other tools one can use. The important thing would be being able to batch process so that you can rename or retag large groups of files at one time. A tool that can also use the tag information to build a filename is also useful. I have chosen to store my music in the following filename format:

[drive]:/[music directory]/[Artist]/[Album]/Artist-trackname.mp3

I chose this format simply because the other information is in the tag -- personal preference really.

Next comes the organization in the Zune software itself. One of the things you may have noticed is that when viewing by Artist or by Album on the device, songs show up as not grouped into an album even though they have the same album title. The browser on the Zune itself as well as the Zune software will parse (or read) the tags and determine how the content is displayed. For that reason, files that should be grouped must have similar tagging. The usual suspects are:

• Year
• Genre
• Contributing Artist
• Album Art

To properly group tracks into an Album, the tags should match exactly on the following:

• Album Title
• Artist
• Year
• Genre
• Contributing Artist (when possible)

Albums that really buck the trend are compilation discs (ex. Best of the 70's) and Soundtracks. Typically, with these I set the artist to Various Artist for the Album and make sure the Contributing Artist has the correct Artist information.

All of this so far is pretty basic but what do you do when it appears everything is tagged correctly but it is not displaying correctly? This is where my OCD really kicks in. There are several different views you can use to troubleshoot anomalies in the way your content is displayed. However, I usually start by looking at how it appears on the device. Rather than unplug the device, I will use the navigation tree to browse the contents. This should be a fairly accurate representation of how it will appear when it is in your hand.

My first cut will be a view by Album. Selecting the Album link displays all of the covers and will quickly show you if a single album is showing up as a multiple album. This is evident because it looks like more than one album cover stacked on another. Use the Search box to isolate just the album(s) you want and then double-click on them to view the tracks. Most likely, you will have two entries. Go back to your Library, and perform the same search and view the tracks in the library. Change the Album, Artist, Year, and Genre tags to match and the tracks should be merged into one album. If they are not, time to go to phase two.

Change the display from Icon to detail so the album art is gone. Then use Customize Columns and ensure that Contributing Artist, Year, Genre, and Album are visible. For tracks that don't have the correct information, make your changes. Once you have made all of the changes, perform a quick sync. You can now go back to navigation and view your device and ensure that the changes synched over.

Once you have looked at your device by Album, you may want to now correct all of the Artist information. By that, I mean some songs may be tagged Beatles while others are The Beatles. This can easily be seen when viewing detail by Artist. Make your changes and sync again. You should be able to browse the device using the Navigation tree and see your changes.

My next little bit of OCD comes in with Genres. If you view by Genre, you may see tracks you want to consolidate. You may also want to get rid of the Unknown genre. Typically, I will merge Rap with Rap/R&B, Heavy Metal with Hard Rock, etc. This is mostly for when listening by genre. You don't end up with the odd symphony not being on the playlist because it is Easy Listening and not Classical. You also don't want to end up with Pods, Podcasts, Podcast, and Webcasts strung out over different genres.

You may also want to take a look at sorting by Year. Although I don't research the year of every track, typically I don't like Unknown showing up when sorted.

As with all of these, you can select multiple tracks and Edit Tag Info to make mass changes. Occasionally, these changes don't seem to be saved and you may need to edit individual tags for individual songs. In each case, syncing and browsing the device in the navigation window will give you an idea of how it will be displayed on the Zune.

Using the Find Album Info feature is useful but is not always foolproof. At times, tracks will not be matched or the tagging doesn't quite fit. I have seen on more than one occasion 10 tracks on an album with genre A while one track has genre B. If you right-lick on the album and select Find Album Info, it will try to match all of the songs. If it is having a problem finding the songs, you may also Find Info for each song individually. This has yielded results in quite a few cases for me. Once the Album info has been updated, you may want to use the previously mentioned steps to make sure all of the tagging is in order.

Amazon.com is your friend when it comes to Album Art. Normally, once I have added a new album, I will give it a few minutes to let the software try to find information. I may hurry that along by clicking the album cover and Find Album Info. If art doesn't show up, I'll do an Amazon search and find the cover. Right-click on the picture of the cover and select copy. Go to the Zune software and right-click on the blank album cover and Paste Album Art. All tracks will be updated with album art.

If you still find tracks that appear to have all of the tagging in order but still show up as multiple albums when they are not, you may want to Edit Tag Info, click the pictures tab, and for each track delete anything that is found. Normally, your pasted album art will not be deleted and this may fix the problem. Shortly after I purchased my Zune, I had more than a few tracks for which I had added multiple pictures and that seemed to throw off the sorting.

I would not try to do all of this at once. I had considered my collection fairly organized but ended up spending an hour or two over the course of a week to get the library itself organized. If you do much of the validation when you add new tracks, it will make things go much more smoothly.

Keeping the tags organized will also be helpful in making playlists. Rather than search for particular artists for my Alternative list, I simply pick songs from that genre. I can do the same when building an oldies list and simply sort by year (not as useful for re-pressings and re-releases though).

As you are using the Zune and you see things out of place, use the Flag feature to mark a file so you can take a look at it later. While the file is playing, press the center button and select Flag. The file will then show up in your Inbox. When you get home to sync, view the files in your Inbox, correct whatever tags may be incorrect, remove them from the Inbox and re-sync.

One thing that happens from time to time is a file is not flagged to be re-synced. In this case, you may get a file tagged one way in the library and a different way on your device. I will usually do one of the following to correct this.

• Change a tag to something completely different (like year or Artist) and sync. Change the tag back and re-sync.
• Delete from the device using the navigation in the software. Go to Sync Results and flag that file to be synched. Re-sync and check the file.
• Completely remove file from device and library. Sync. Add file back to library and re-sync.

This will be a lot of work at the start but makes maintaining the library quite easy going forward.

[Dizzy]

Excellent stuff you got here.

I'm a sucker for properly tagged tracks as well. Personally, I use MusicBrainz, but it's more of a personal preference. If anything, it makes it look all the sweeter.

One other thing I'd mention while in the Zune software. When you've got one album that the software has (for one reason or another) split into two, skip the hassle of tag editing. Look and see which of the two albums has the most complete/correct data and drag the second on top of it. This causes the Zune software to merge the two albums and give the second album (with the incomplete tags) the characteistics of the first.

I assume you're looking for a sticky? It deserves one, though for some reason, I can't decide if this is the correct section.

[Cheapliquid]

I have all my music on my Windows Media player, and because it's all my cd's rarely any downloaded songs, i have em all set up correctly, i hate when you have a bunch of files, that's all like various, or unknown, or the computer has the contributing artist on the song, which then pulls it from the original album, so i just double check things, because no one wants random songs not apart of albums..

[Khu]

Thanks for the comments Dizzy. A sticky would be cool but I'm with you -- not quite sure in which section this should be. It seemed a lot of questions are answered by simply pointing out various features or tips and tricks in the software so thought I would get a few together while I had time on my hands (on vacation this week). Put this where ever you think it might do the most good.

And that tip about dragging one album to another is gold. I will most definitely be using that in the future.

Edit: Thanks for the tip on MusicBrainz. That looks like a really good find.

[Dizzy]

I use Media Monkey as my all purpose media player. It's got a rad organize music feature. WMP11's lacks a little, but it's manageable. And I agree, anything "unknown" bothers me for some reason ('cept for genres, cause I'm just to lazy to change all those)

I'ma see if one of the higher ups would possibly approve a "General Zune Software" sub-forum.

You've got some great stuff Khu. Keep up the good work

[jubby2000]

I like many other people have tried everything with the new software to get my songs under the correct album and so on. Deleting the old files that were imported from the old software was a good start, but I was still having problems. Here is what I did to fix it, and it worked:

1. Open up the Zune software and click on list-view under your collection.

2. There are a few options here, Album, Artist, Title, etc. What you need to do is right-click on the screen and edit the Columns. Choose from the list, "Album Artist". And click ok. Album Artist will now be an option for you to edit in list view.

3. Scroll down to the artist where different songs are getting sorted under (for me, it was 50 Cent). You will notice that the album probably reverted back to some other album even though you probably changed it a million times. For this to stick, you first have to change the Album Artist. Right-click on the song, click edit, and then either tab over to Album Artist, or right-click directly on Album Artist to edit it. Copy verbatim the name of the original artist and then shift-tab or tab to complete the other incorrect information before you hit enter.

4. The song will move in place when you hit enter, which may frustrate you if you're trying to edit multiple songs in the same area (you can do that too if you just keep hitting tab and wait to hit enter until the end), but you can just get back to the artist by typing in the name, very cool feature they added by the way. That's it, once you're done editing Album Artist, they will stay where they are supposed to and won't revert back.

Note: I tried editing the Album Artist on the file directly many times, and it just wouldn't stick. This is the only thing that has done it for me.

Another Note: If this is too confusing and people really want to try it, maybe I'll figure out how to post pictures on here to show everyone.

[Dizzy]

That is pretty nifty. I'd hate for this to be lost in the mass, so I think I'm going to merge with library organization tips stick

[nerys]

I FRAKING LOVE YOU !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I even opened songs into goldwave and REENCODED THEM TO NO FRAKING AVAIL !!!!

Where the HELL is it getting this ALBUM ARTISTS ilk from and how do I IRRADICATE IT. Your method worked a TREAT a damned DREAM but its largely not useful. I have THOUSANDS of songs to do. I do not see ALBUM ARTIST in any tagging program AND I even went so far as to DELETE ALL ID3 TAGS and REBUILD the tags from FILE NAME and it STILL have this "album artists" crap in it in the zune software (is ZUNE creating this non existant tag ?)

I just had a flashing nightmare. if I made ALL OF THEM Various would it merge all my albums. NO thank god once I make this artist album crap all the same thing it CORRECTLY looks at just ALBUM to sort them. Thank god for that.

I still need a MASS way to alter this tag since it would take what would feel like a life time to alter my THOUSANDS of "errant" tracks in this manner. I tried Highlighting the whole album in list view but it greys the EDIT button when I do this.

I just reopened this "corrected" files in ID3 Tag It and that tag DOES NOT EXIST on any screen I can find. So is this a NO STANDARD tag entry that the zune software is creating on its own?

HOW does it determine what to put in this fabricated tag entry? is there any software that will let me change it ENMASS so I can do say ALL of them at onces? I will take all the thousands of mp3's I have in our household and make EVERY SINGLED DAMNED ONE OF THEM "Drop Dead Microsoft" for Album Artist :-)

Thank you SO MUCH while it does not FIX my problem it DOES apply a bandaid and I at least can not IDENTIFY partially what the problem is!!!

Thank you so much!

[nerys]

Another Note - if you EDIT the ID3 outside of the ZUNE software and then go back into the ZUNE software it "SCREWS" with this lbum artists tag again and you have to do the edit one line at a time thing OVER AGAIN. I am so glad I discovered this BEFORE I did a few hundred of these. Have I mentioned how much I HATE zune software?

We need a way to PRESET this special tag ahead of time (apparently SETTING it in zune software gets UNSET in other software even though this special tag does not even EXIST in other software. Go figure.

OR a way to FORCE zune software to ALWAYS use the same entry for all tags no matter any other information.

OR a way to change MORE than one at a time in ZUNE software.

Suggestions?

UPDATE - I found a slightly faster way to edit. Pick your word (I just chose Various) and COPY IT (ctrl + c)

NOW right click choose colums and UNCHECK everything it will let you uncheck.

NOW right click edit your FIRST entry and ctrl + v
Now tab and tab again your on the NEXT lbum artists

ctrl + v tab tab ctrl + v tab tab etc.. etc..

Was able to do 120 songs in about 25 seconds. MUCH faster I keep my left fingers on CTRL+V and my right hand over my left whacking TAB twice. Get a nice rythm going just make sure your on ALBUM ARTISTS each time you paste and not SONG :-)

ALSO I went and redid my album name and genre names. Example Malt Shop Memories is 8 disks 4 "sets" or 2 disc albums. I made each album Malt Shop Memories - Set Name

SO I redid that to just SET NAME ie album name and then made the GENRE Malt Shop Memories. SO he can do album for one set OR genre to play all 4 sets at once. Works nice.

ANYWAY I noticed TWO of the sets DID NOT revert to the previous "artist album" they retained the VARIOUS title I put in. I am not sure why this is. If I figure it out I will post the info but I am clue how to even test it.

[Dizzy]

Nice work. This guide was actually written before the new software, but it holds true for about any media manager.

Something to keep in mind:
Instead of changing tags elsewhere AND the Zune library, change your tags elsewhere, the rebuild the library.
See the "Library Build Problems" fix
Here: http://www.zuneboards.com/forums/gen...re-issues.html

[luskae]

is the copy and paste rule still good for the new software and is find album info in the new software as well, because i cant find them

[noxxy]

I had this is same problem in wmp11. I would move the album over into wmp11 and it would split up it 4 different albums. Then if I moved over to the Zune software it would split to 4 albums with different album art. I still don't know how to fix the album art but I fixed the splits. In wmp11 you drag the album that split up on top of its self. Meaning you take the separate albums and drag and drop them one on to the next until it becomes one album. Then you open the album and use wmp11's advance tag editor and click on the tab that says artist and it should give you to boxes to fill in. Both of them having to do with artist, I'm at work so i don't have access to it right now but I know that you change the second artist box to various(for continuous play mix cds with different artist) and when you drag and drop it into the Zune software it should be 1 album. It worked for me. Make sure you highlight all the songs and then right click to bring up the advance tag editor.
Good Luck!

[Dizzy]

Originally Posted by luskae

is the copy and paste rule still good for the new software and is find album info in the new software as well, because i cant find them

Find album info is there under the setting menu. Copy and Paste, not so much

[Justananomaly]

If you have the resync bug then you're probably aware of the fact that you have duplicates of songs on the device, but with the device plugged up you will notice that when you search the device with the software, it only shows one copy of those tracks.

This is caused by many things, and here are four things that *might* fix it for you and are worth a try:

- Null (Empty) Album Tag Bug
For some,
Every track with "Unknown Album" is resyncing over and over again leaving clutter on their device and costing them sync time.
I'm not sure of the exact cause but I found if you fill in the empty tags they will stop resyncing. If Zune refuses to have any information for those tracks you will have to manually fill in the blanks.
The fastest way I know:
1) Settings > Device, clear your Zune of all data and then unplug your device.
2) Close the software.
3) Download Winamp (Full), let it scan for all your music.
4) Now, sort by "Album" by clicking the album tab at the top, select all the tracks with a blank spot where the album is suppose to be via click+drag or shift+arrow.
5) Hit Ctrl+E and the Mass-Edit box opens, click the checkbox beside "Album" and type "Uknown Album" and click ok. This fills in the blanks for all the tracks you have with a blank album tag
6) Exit winamp
7) Open the Zune software, wait for all the media to be updated in the collection, plug your device back in and sync.

- Tag Formatting:
It appears that ID3v2.4 UTF-8 tags are guarenteed 100% to never have issues with the Zune software or the device itself (Thank you WillysJeepMan!). Most of the time the other tags work, but not always. You will need to write down the tracks that keep resycing.
Once you have the list, you will have to completly remove the tags from the tracks that keep resyncing and tag them using Mp3Tag. Afterwards clear your device and resync everything.

- Rebuild Collection:
Delete your ZuneStore file so it complety rebuilds your Zune softwares collection.
1) Close the software and unplug your Zune.
2) Click Start > Run and type (where Username is your windows account name):
XP: C:\Documents And Settings\Username\Application Data\Local\Microsoft\Zune
Vista C:\Users\Username\Appdata\Local\Microsoft\Zune
3)Delete the ZuneStore file located there.
4) Open the software back up and let it scan for your library complely. Once it's done

- One-By-One (Khu's method)
It's best to just read it how he explained it at the bottem of this thread.

Hope that helps!

[jubby2000]

I, among many of you, have tried the multiple "fixes" to get the album artwork correct, songs with the right albums, and artists named correctly. Lots of these fix many problems (I highly suggest rebuilding the database by the way if you haven't, that one is huge), however, for me there were 8-10 songs that would always seem "sticky" and revert back to a certain artist and claim a different album (e.g. Ne-Yo, 'In My Own Words' would become 50 Cent, 'The Massacre') no matter how many times I typed it in correctly. After another frustrating weekend of trying to fix it, I came across this post on another website:

"It has to do with the specific format coding of the tags... NOT the value of the tags that was the problem. In MP3Tag you have the choice to write tags as follows:

ID3v1, ID3v2 (either/or/both)
If you specify ID3v2, then you have the following sub-options:

ID3v2.4 UTF-8
ID3v2.3 UTF-16
ID3v2.3 ISO-8859-1

When I specified either of the ID3v2.3 formats, the errors persisted. When I specified ID3v2.4 UTF-8 (and reimported all of my albums) all, and I mean ALL of my importation problems disppeared. Awesome!

If someone else who is having difficulties can try this to see if it works for them, we may have just found the solution."

I tried this personally on those few songs that were giving me issues, and every single one sorted themselves right to where they should be. NO PROBLEMS WHATSOEVER. Try it, nothing to lose right?

Tools>Options>Tags>Mpeg
Under "Write" choose ONLY ID3v2 and ID3v2.4 UTF-8. That's it. You don't necessarily have to change your metadata (unless it's wrong), but you do have to click on them and hit "Save" to make sure it saves in the correct format.

I'd post pictures, but I don't know where I can upload them to link to here. Sorry. Let me know if you'd like more info.